Meet Your Hosts

Adam & Thora introduce the show and tell their origin stories. Enjoy!

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Transcript:

Adam:    00:00:08    Hello! And welcome to the Adam show.  

Adam:    00:00:10    It’s not the Adam show. You said it was all about me. You said if I joined you, it would be all about me. Just kidding. Welcome people.  

Thora:    00:00:19    This is Autism On Shift. Uh, today we’re just going to tell you about our show. Uh, introduce ourselves. 

Adam: I’m obviously Adam.

Thora: I’m Thora. We are your hosts. We’re married and we run the show for funsies. 

Adam: We run the show. 

Thora: So the title of the show is Autism On Shift. So we are actually talking to autistic people at work about, yeah, well, not at work, they’re usually not at work when they’re talking to us.  

Adam:    00:00:47    It’s better than being on Facebook. We know you people out there.  

Thora:    00:00:51    Me. I’m on Facebook.

Adam: At work? 

Thora: Oh no! 

Adam: Well. Don’t listen…. Dave 

Thora: So basically we talk to autistic people about their jobs, what they do for work. What is fun about it? Um, and how being autistic, uh, makes a difference at work.  

Adam:    00:01:13    Yep. Hence “on shift”. Also on shift is sort of the wordplay, you know, where we want to change the perspective that, uh, anybody can do anything. There’s a staggering statistic that  

Thora:    00:01:29    84% of autistic adults are unemployed or underemployed.  

Adam:    00:01:35    Right. And so we want to, uh, we want to change the employer’s idea of what people can do. We want to, um, on a lot of the, uh, sites you go on, people are always asking, uh,  

Thora:    00:01:47    Yeah, what do you do for work? What can I do? What am I capable of? And it’s a, it’s a huge conversation in the autistic community.  

Adam:    00:01:53    Right. So we thought we’d talked to some people and, and just put it out there and, and, and answer those questions  

Thora:    00:01:59    And make a shift in that social conversation, uh, you know, about what, uh, autistic people are capable of. So that’s why we’re here. 

Adam: So we’re witty. 

Thora: I don’t know about all that. 

Adam: I’m sure we are. 

Thora: Uh, so I’m Thora T H O R A Thora like the thunder god, but within an A. 

Adam: The A is for Adam. 

Thora: So my story is, I was late diagnosed. I was diagnosed almost two years ago at age 42. And I’m sure, like many of you, it had me kind of looking back at my life and understanding more things.  

Adam:    00:02:43    I’m not so weird.  

Thora:    00:02:46    Yeah. Well, I am weird of course I’m weird.

Adam: That’s what I like about ya. 

Thora: But that, there’s a reason for it as opposed to just, um, 

Adam: Something’s wrong with me

Thora: Right. I’m not broken and it’s been this amazing filter through which I could look at, um, the situations in my life and, and what put me there. And it’s, um, it’s been super helpful. Um, I think one of the biggest things, one of the biggest perspective changes I have received from my diagnosis is understanding why I can’t manage to keep a job. I have, um, either left or gotten fired from pretty much every job I’ve ever had.  

Adam:    00:03:28    Yeah. Since we’ve been together. 

Thora: Well, I mean, it is every job I’ve ever had. 

Adam: Oh, really?  

Thora:    00:03:34    At about a year, year and a half ish. Yeah. It’s like, I can only mask for so long. Right.  

Adam:    00:03:39    You made one for a whole two years. That was a record.  

Thora:    00:03:44    But of course I was a complete and total mess by the end of two years. 

Adam: That’s true. 

Thora: A lot of masking has to happen for us at work, I think. Um, and I don’t think it’s right. Um, so  

Adam:    00:03:55    It sounds sort of a breakdown.  

Thora:    00:03:57    Oh yeah. I had a complete it’s. Yeah. Autistic burnout, I think is, is kind of the terminology that I 

Adam: Of course we didn’t know that at the time. 

Thora: Oh no, no. I just thought I was just mentally losing it. 

Adam: Right. 

Thora: Um, and actually that’s kind of how I got my diagnosis. I, um, had been seeing psychiatrists for a couple of years at that point and nobody really kind of could put a pin in it. Right. Nobody knew what my deal was. I had a massive number of, uh, unrelated diagnoses and, um, I’m sure this is common. It’s common, particularly in autistic women. Um, we get a lot of, you know, um, you know, bipolar or borderline personality disorder or, um, you know, schizotypal or, uh, OCD. And we get a lot of weird diagnoses before somebody actually like really can configure us out. Actually most women figure themselves out long before a doctor does.  

Thora:    00:04:54    I am kind of the, the, the weird one in that mine was total surprise. 

Adam: It was

Thora: So yeah, anyway, it was, uh, it was a couple of years and I had a scheduling issue, put me in the, in the office of another psychiatrist and she looked at my file. She talked to me and she said, none of this makes any sense. So she sent me for a full psychological evaluation. Um, and it was, uh, it was a long process. It was like eight months, lots of sessions, lots of tests. Uh, at the end, the diagnostician sat me down and I believe her exact words were, you have a little bit of autism. And of course my response was no, I don’t because I didn’t know anything about autism at the time. And I made a lot of really harmful assumptions that most people I think make. Um, so, um, um, um, we’re out to change that.  

Adam:    00:05:45    Yeah, exactly. I think a lot of the things, um, you know, we also have a daughter with Down syndrome and I think, you know, uh, a lot of things are more clear when you see yourself being in that place of not understanding everybody, you know, and, uh, all of a sudden there’s a child with Down syndrome and we learn all about this child with Down syndrome and it, you know, and it really puts, so it kind of shines the light on seeing how ignorant I was to, or maybe just the lack of understanding, you know, a lot of us until we have somebody in our lives lives that’s, you know, autistic or with Down syndrome, you know, you start to understand what it means to, you know, to   

Thora:    00:06:31     Well know there’s this, there’s a whole different world that opens up to you when you’re part of those communities. And most people aren’t part of those communities, so they don’t understand us or, um, or they don’t even oftentimes know we exist or they just have this, you know, um, small idea in the back of their head from some, uh, really huge, disgusting organization that, uh, has a big mouth. Um,  

Adam:    00:06:55    I think for him, I mean, the point is, is the, you know, being on both sides of that and seeing what I, you know, what I didn’t know and what I know now and, and seeing, you know, what a different perspective that was, it’s, you know, this is why we’re here. 

Thora: Yeah, absolutely.  

Thora:    00:07:12    Uh, no, but back to, um, my whole, you know, the diagnosis came, I was surprised. And then of course I did what I do about everything was read and read and read and read and, and read.  

Adam:    00:07:25    It’s like, you’re a researcher for your day job.  

Thora:    00:07:27    It is, it is like, I’m a researcher for a day job, but am I really?  

Adam:    00:07:33    The world will never know?  

Thora:    00:07:36    Um, no, but of course the more I read, the more I realized, Oh yeah, that’s that’s me. Yep. Check that, check that check. Um, and then it kind of trickled out from there. It was kind of like, Oh, then I realized that my daughter was autistic. And then I realized that, you know, Adam, Adam’s probably autistic. And then I’m like, Oh, I think my son might be autistic. So we’re just a house full of autistic people. And it’s awesome. Um, but kind of one of the things that has me be in this space where we’re talking about like jobs and things like that is that, um, my, one of my huge special interests is job hunting. And that was partly out of necessity because, uh, as I said before, I couldn’t keep a job. So I had to get really good at getting jobs. 

Adam: And she’s an expert at that. 

Thora: I am, it is become a massive, special interest. I enjoy the entire process. I love it. It’s like a, it’s like, it’s like gambling to me. Right. Like you, you know, you put your bet out there and you sit and wait, you know, they gonna call the right number. Is it going to be, you know, never  

Adam:    00:08:40    They never call me! Sorry.  

Thora:    00:08:42    Um, but yeah, so I’ve learned to get really good at that. And so now I, you know, um, I run a business, uh, writing resumes for the autistic community, um, interview coaching, that kind of stuff. Um, and it just kind of, uh, branched out into this podcast where we realized we just wanted to talk to people about their jobs and it’s such a fascinating, um, thing for, uh, for, for people in the community to, to know. Um, it’s something that I, I hear asked a lot, uh, in, in forums and boards. So that’s me, uh, Adam, however, uh, is not diagnosed, not officially. Um, I guess we could, we could say self-diagnosed, which is completely valid. We are a, um, a huge proponent of self-diagnosis because we know how hard it is to actually get a diagnosis for many people. Um, for many reasons financially, um, uh, I don’t know, time wise, um, well, medical gaslighting, too, that’s a massive thing. Right. They don’t believe you, or people don’t know enough to be able to, you know what I mean? So you can even go try to get a diagnosis and people aren’t, you know, it’s,  

Adam:    00:09:50    There’s a lot of factors that makes it very difficult. It can. Yeah.  

Thora:    00:09:54    Um, but the fact is that, you know, you don’t need a piece of paper that says that you are who you are.  

Adam:    00:10:01    Yeah. And, um, frankly I’m not comfortable to, at this point in my life, you know, there’s definitely nothing wrong with it, but I’m a slow changer, you know, like, you know, the more I talk with people, of course, you know, we’ve, we’ve interviewed people at this point already. We’ve done a couple intros, but, uh, we’re going backwards. Yeah. But, uh, you know, I’ve learned a lot and I, and it, and I realized that, um, a lot of things would be helpful in, uh, kind of hiding out where I am is hurtful to some relationships. Um, but you know, that’s where I am. That’s where I’m comfortable with, um, not out at work. I, uh, it’s just, it’s, I don’t really want people to know for, for me, it’s, you know, look, I’m always just, I’m fighting to kind of fit in. I’ve never felt like I fit in properly. Um, it’s always felt like  

Thora:    00:10:50    You have an ability to do so, even if you don’t feel it’s, I’m sure it’s exhausting. Masking sucks. 

Adam:    00:10:55    It can’t, it can be very exhausting. Um, I’m good at it. Um, and I’ve learned through life and, you know, and, and I think bef before this, I’ve just kind of thought, Hey, I’m really good at figuring out how to, how to camouflage, how to mask, you know, and that’s, and I’m proud of it. And so, like, I don’t want to give that up, you know, it’s something that I’ve built and I’m kind of, that’s just the way I am. I like to build things. And until I’m like, okay, I don’t need to stand on this castle anymore. I can move to the next thing. Um, but you know, I, I’m proud of the things I build in. So, um, I am an architect. Um, it’s something I enjoy doing. So,

Thora: But are you THE architect?

Adam: We’re not going to tell everybody about that. A magician never tells his tricks. 

Adam:    00:11:40    Um, but you know what I mean, the more Thora researches, uh, the more I realized, you know, I looked back at my childhood simple things. I used to build Legos again, architect, um, huge into legos I had all of my

Thora: You still have all your legos

Adam: I do, I do. I don’t play with them every day, but one day I’m going to take them back out. And the whole house is going to be filled up with Legos, but I had all my models as a child, uh, you know, on shelves and such. And, uh, I had my friend, uh, over, I remember this clearly, uh, he would wait until I turned around doing something. He would move all my models around only to watch me turn back around and go in and be like, Hey man, don’t do that. And then rush and put them all back in their place. Of course the dust would tell me exactly where to put them. So that was a kid I didn’t dust. Um, you know, but I mean, these things are more obvious. I mean, this is the kinds of things that are more and more obvious as it is for everybody. Like Thora was saying, the more she did the research, the more obvious her whole life, all these things were more clear and it’s becoming more and more clear for my, uh, for my life.  

Thora:    00:12:55    Yeah. Well, and it’s, it’s interesting too, because you, and you, you always say that you fell into your job, you did not. I mean,  

Adam:    00:13:01    Yeah, that’s a good point. So yeah, I mean, I, I’m a merchandiser, which, you know, putting things in their place is perfect and I’m really good at my job. I, it, but, uh, you know, one, one of the times Thora lost her jobs, you know, we, uh, we were kind of almost down and out and we, uh, went through a temp agency and I got this job as, uh, doing vending machines and, um, you know, something I would have never picked, uh, but it turned into this merchandising position where, uh, at first it was just filling vending machines and now it’s, you know, filling up, uh, you know, like a 7-11 type stores in large industries where, um, you know, I’m ordering food and drinks and, uh, you know, salads and whatever. And, and I’m, and I’m making it look pretty. I’m making everything look really nice and, and I love it.  

Thora:    00:13:53    And it’s not, you know, it’s not just about the looks, he’s super humble, but I’m going to tell you, he is excellent at his job. And what he does is not just put things in their place, but there, he, like, he determines psychologically what the best place placement is for certain things, so that people actually purchase more. And it’s, it’s kind of helpful because I mean, you’re on commission. So the more people buy, the more money you make. And so, you know, it’s just one of those things, the harder you work and the better you are at your job, the more you make and it’s super helpful.  

Adam:    00:14:22    And this is one of the reasons I love my wife, because she is so nice to me. And she always says, how cool I am. Um, one of the things I, uh, I think was interesting, we were talking about a little bit just, um, about this. I remember taking this online test, the Aspie quiz, you know, of course, Thora said, take this. And I’m like, ah, god, this is like a hundred questions. You know, the last thing I want to do. Um, but it, it is interesting because where I fit in going back to talking about how I kind of masking and I’m good at doing that, um, I’m kind of like I’m right in the center. So like, you know, I’m this big circle right. In the center of, you know, uh, what do you,  

Thora:    00:15:04    You’re like halfway in, yeah. You’re halfway in the neuro diverse and halfway in the neuro-typical.   

Adam:    00:15:09    Right. And so of course you’re like way over to the, you know, to the one side and of course I’m right in the center, but it it’s, um, it’s,  

Thora:    00:15:18    I’ve got a couple of little like juts. They jut out like over to the neuro-diverse side.  

Adam:    00:15:23    Yeah. Um, but it allows me to kind of do my job with people. Uh, and you know, I talk, I mean, I don’t get deep into conversation sometimes I do. And I love that when I get to. Um, but generally, you know, uh, the thousands of people I see, you know, it’s, uh, 

Thora: Hey bud, how you doing? 

Adam: Well? Yeah. And I, you know, and I like to be nice and I enjoy people. I just, I, you know, I, I, I find it hard to get into real conversations with people about things, whatever.  

Thora:    00:15:54    Well, that’s, that’s common with anybody. Nobody ever. I mean, people don’t get deep, they don’t want to get deep. It’s scary and vulnerable and, and  

Adam:    00:16:02    Right. But I do enjoy it.  

Thora:    00:16:04    Yeah. Oh yeah. I just mean most people, like when you, like, I haven’t,  

Adam:    00:16:08    You’re right. People don’t want to. I know that.  

Thora:    00:16:10    I have a thing and I hate this whole, I hate small talk. I think it’s just, it’s just disruptive. It’s disturbing and you really don’t care how I am. So why are you asking? But, uh, every once in a while, uh, you know, I’ll get the right person, like someone will ask me, how are you? And I’ve, I’ve trained myself to respond now to this as, um, well, do you want me to be honest or nice? Uh, and most people just kind of scoff, like how rude, you know?  

Adam:    00:16:33    Yeah. Just say, just say the answer, you know, the answer, just say, good. That’s all you say, you don’t say I’m sick. I’m feeling bad. You just say, I’m fine. That’s the answer. 

Thora: That’s the social contract. Don’t, you know? Yeah. 

Adam: You’re making me uncomfortable, man.  

Thora:    00:16:48    Yeah. So those people, I can just write off pretty quickly. And it’s, uh, so it’s kind of like this little litmus test. Right. Um, but sometimes people will just kind of chuckle and it’ll, you know, it’ll just be like, Oh yeah, I guess it is kind of a silly question, but then there’s like those rare people every once in a while, then I’ll just say, Hey, you want me to be honest or nice? And they’ll be like, yeah. You know what? That is a really strange question to ask people, especially if you don’t even know the answer, and then it becomes this huge conversation about the ridiculousness of social conventions. And then those people are like the gold, you know, I’m pannting for gold when I’m talking to people,  

Adam:    00:17:19    It’s a good point. And it is like that. So I, you know, cause like that with people that I should get to have those real conversations with it’s, you know, three out of the thousand, you know, I have these deep conversations. I can’t wait to see them the next time. And of course now I’m too busy. I’m like, I’ll talk to you next time. You know? But anyway, uh, one of the things that’s interesting about, uh, the way that you and I work together, because we are different, we have our strengths and weaknesses is, um, just that, that we work well together. But, um, yeah.  

Thora:    00:17:50    And you kind of, you kind of function as, uh, like I kind of call you like my translator, right. Because I am so I’m like, I’m, I’m an oblivious autistic. Okay. Like I walk around completely, uh, unaware of how I affect people socially.  

Adam:    00:18:05    I’m like, Thora, put your pants on! People, you know, some people are going to be offended by that, you know?  

Thora:    00:18:16    But yeah. I mean, that’s, that’s quite literally what, you know, like how we operate together when we’re out in the world, like you help me kind of melt into, um, kind of the social structure or whatever, because I, I don’t understand a lot of that. Or sometimes I’ll come to you and I’ll ask, Hey, what did someone mean when they said X, Y, Z,  

Adam:    00:18:34    Well, why did they have that? Why did they have that weird look on my face when I wasn’t wearing my pants? I said, okay, she wears her pants, but you know, mostly skirts. Thora: That’s right. I love my skirts.  

Thora:    00:18:44    Well, yeah. That’s 

Thora: Yeah. So you’re like my translator, my NT translator. Right. Neuro-typical for those of you that don’t know what NT stands for. Um, yeah. I, I don’t, I don’t often understand what someone means or what they intend by the things that they say. And so I always have to ask you before I respond,  

Adam:    00:19:02    I’m glad to help. And you’re more of a, you’re the anchor in the relationship, which I’d like for you to explain to our listeners.  

Thora:    00:19:11    I kind of like, I stay on track. I make sure that we’re, that we’re both staying on track. Um, Adam has this fun tendency to like veer off on these tangents. No, it’s awesome. I love it because 

Adam: Squirrel, 

Thora: because tangents are fun and tangents kind of like, you know, they help you learn things and they help you, you know? Uh, it’s just makes conversation with them,  

Adam:    00:19:34    Brings different things in, although that doesn’t always fit  

Thora:    00:19:38    Well, but here’s the thing, like, it’s fun, but you know, there’s still like, you know, like, like in our interviews when we do this podcast, like, it’s, you know, you, you veer off and, um, you know, I kind of have it, like, it’s my job to bring us back.  

Adam:    00:19:54    Oh, it is your job. Like I said, you’re the anchor.  

Thora:    00:19:57    Yeah. I mean, we just gotta, we got to stay on track. Otherwise these, these, uh, interviews would take like three hours. Yeah.  

Adam:    00:20:03    Some have some there might’ve been a drink or two in there.  

Thora:    00:20:10    Um, but yeah, so I mean, that’s kind of how we work together. Um, what we’re up to when we do this podcast is really, um, we, first of all, we love meeting all of you. We love meeting autistic people. We love learning from autistic people. I mean, we all have this massive wealth of knowledge and it’s so fun to meet. I mean, how many interviews we’ve done so far, we’ve done like nine or 10 or 10. Yeah. And, uh, and everyone has been so fun and so fascinating. And we’ve learned something from literally everyone.  

Adam:    00:20:44    Absolutely. And it’s been really, it’s been really good getting to know people. I mean, it has been a pandemic after all. And so it’s really nice to, to sit here. And of course, for, for you guys, it’s just, you know, you hear us, it’s a podcast, but of course for us, when we’re, uh, talking with people, you know, we have a video because it’s easier to read lips and see facial expressions and, you know, to kind of know where we’re going. And, um, but we really get to know people and really get to enjoy these people. I mean, and we get, I feel like we’ve gotten close with everybody and it’s been enjoyable, you know, and, and there’s a lot to learn.  

Thora:    00:21:20    We’re having fun and we’re learning, but you know, the whole point of the thing is really to change the stigma of autistic people, uh, in, in the workplace specifically. Uh, but you know, just in the general social conversation, like, you know, Hey, there’s more of us than you think there are. I promise you, I guarantee you, you know, autistic people and you probably don’t know it.  

Adam:    00:21:41    Yeah. And in the workplace, we, you know, one of the other things is we really want to show our strengths in the workplace because I don’t think that’s quite obvious all the time.  

Thora:    00:21:50    No, it’s not. I remember, um, when I first got my job, uh, actually this is the first time I have disclosed and 

Adam: It’s true. That’s right. Yeah. 

Thora: Um, which was, uh, w which is kind of cool. And I think it’s allowed me to not have to mask so much, which is awesome,  

Adam:    00:22:04    Comfortable being you. And, and when you deal with something that you feel has been in your way before, it’s, it’s something you can, you can talk to and you can go back to and say, look, I’ve already disclosed this. We can, I can just discuss, what’s weird for me right now. Hey, I might need some help with this. It’d be very helpful for you guys to do this for me. Um, what’s that called when asking your employer for the little health and accommodation, in a sense, I mean, it might not sound like it for you, but that’s exactly what it is. And a lot of that terminology, like, things like that for me are very confusing. You hear a combination like, well, what the hell does that mean? You know, in this case, it’s very specifically, I mean, you can give an example, maybe,  

Thora:    00:22:44    Um, like, uh, I’m super blunt. Okay. I, while I am, uh, whatever assigned female at birth, I could, I don’t know how I identify, but whatever. Um, so while I am a woman, I tend to, I don’t tend to my, uh, autistic tendencies are way more, uh, male leaning. I present like an autistic man. Um, I have that social obliviousness. I’m very blunt and direct. Um, so I, so at work, like, particularly like my boss, like, uh, just the other day, as a matter of fact, he asked me if I would, um, kind of oversee a group of people doing a particular task. And I kind of was like, you know, I would love to, and I am perfectly capable of doing so I have done it in the past and I am a great manager. I said, here’s the thing though. Um, I’m blunt.  

Thora:    00:23:40    I am very direct and people don’t often like that. 

Adam: And I don’t know why I love it. 

Thora: I, well, I do too. That’s how I like to be communicated with. I do. I do. Um, and so I told him, and, you know, his response was, if I was just, you know, any old person, you know, his response might be different, but knowing that I’m autistic, he said, you know what? I get that. And we are going to build a team that works with you because it will be your team. You know? And if I didn’t disclose that, he, I would never have that opportunity. Right.  

Adam:    00:24:15    I am. I think that’s weird. Or think you’re just trying to say something other than what you’re saying, or, you know, knowing that you’re blunt, he’s like, Nope, this is exactly what she’s saying, which is,   

Adam:    00:24:27    That as blunt. And I find it as extremely useful, you know, if I didn’t have you in my life, you know, you say something, I know that’s what you mean. There’s no question. There’s no beating around the bush about it  

Thora:    00:24:38    Game with some weird word play or whatever bullshit 

Adam: it’s confusing when people are, you know? 

Thora: Yeah. Anyway. Yeah. Anyway, I totally got I’m the tangent! 

Adam: Look, I was the anchor!  

Adam:    00:24:52    We’re coming each other’s way.  

Thora:    00:24:53    Nice. And after 20 years, you’d think we would learn a little something from each other.  

Adam:    00:24:56    I would imagine. Maybe.  

Thora:    00:24:59    We’re not quite 20 years, almost 20 years, but, but we’ll get there. I promise.  

Adam:    00:25:07    So the other thing is at work, um, w w what we’re doing with this podcast is we want to highlight, uh, you know, basically how to support us, you know, to employers. Right?  

Thora:    00:25:17    Absolutely. And of course, that’s different for everybody. We all have heard the phrase. If you’ve met one autistic person, you’ve met one autistic person, you know, so all of our needs are gonna be different, but, you know, um, just to give people an idea, you know, Hey, maybe, you know, uh, I could offer this type of accommodation, or maybe I could offer this type of, uh, work, uh, task or this type of, um, you know, uh, tool, resource kind of thing. Um, and, and that’s what we’re, that’s the conversation we’re trying to have is just, you know, what are the tools and resources that we need, um, to help us be successful at work? 

Adam: And I think that’s about it. Yeah. 

Thora: Yeah. I mean, that’s what we’re up to. We’re glad you’re joining us. We’ll be here every week. Um, some of our, uh, some of our guests are self-employed, some of our guests are, you know, they have employers and, you know, um, w2s and all that fun stuff. Right. Um, but yeah, so we get to, to run the whole gamut and learn from it  

Adam:    00:26:15    Or from all over the world. So I don’t know, there may not have a W2.  

Thora:    00:26:19    Oh, well, yeah. That’s probably true. All right. Well, uh, thanks for joining us. Uh, come back again, uh, next week, uh, I believe our first guest is a service dog trainer. So look forward to that one. 

Adam: Is it, is that who we’re doing first? 

Thora: Yeah. 

Adam: Okay. 

Thora: We’ve got some exciting interviews coming your way, and, uh, we are always going to have a transcript and show notes, uh, which may or may not include our guests, uh, social media links on our website that is CarveResumes.com carve like carve a name for yourself, CarveResumes.com/podcast. Um, and we’re going to be on any podcatcher that you operate. I’m sure. Um, Spotify, Apple, iTunes, all that fun stuff. Yep. Cool. So 

Adam: Look forward to seeing you next week. 

Thora: Enjoy! 

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