Episode Transcript
Speaker 0 00:00:08 <inaudible> Hey everyone. Hi. Welcome to autism on shift. I'm Thora and I'm Adam. We need guests. Come on the show.
Speaker 1 00:00:20 Talk to us about your job. It doesn't have to be a fancy job.
Speaker 0 00:00:24 It doesn't have to be
Speaker 1 00:00:25 Exciting or, you know, globe trotting,
Speaker 2 00:00:29 But it could be. And if you were that person come on as well, you can go to carve resumes.com and, uh, go to the tab that says podcast in a little, let you sign up.
Speaker 1 00:00:42 Yep. Name, email. We'll take it from there all year.
Speaker 2 00:00:47 And since we don't have any guests and that's not the only reason we're going to interview her, she's very exciting. We're going to talk amongst ourselves.
Speaker 1 00:00:55 That's right today. Uh, we are interviewing Thora Thora say hi, welcome. Well, I mean, it's good. Thank you for having me.
Speaker 2 00:01:08 Good, because that's normally your job. So, uh, that's perfect. Uh, Thora is a, oh man, what is she again? I'm doing your fine now. So I do that. She is a employment consultant. Um, and I don't know if you mind, uh, but because I know our listeners a lot of times, um, go through often what we go through. Uh, one of the things that brought us to this being your main job is that you lost your last job. Um, and I don't know if that's okay with you.
Speaker 1 00:01:42 Oh yeah. Um, yeah, uh, it was right on time too. About a year, about a year. It was almost exactly a year.
Speaker 2 00:01:50 And I brought that up because I know that's something that people deal with regularly. And we've found with a lot of our guests, you know, half of our guests, you know, a lot of times become self-employed because it's easier to be self-employed than to be employed by others. And I thought, maybe wanted to share first before we got into planning consulting is what you do. Um, kind of talk about, uh, what, how that feels kind of what leads to it. Uh, you know, something that you can share that our listeners also deal with. Um, we
Speaker 1 00:02:23 Want to talk about that. Yeah, yeah. Um, this time was different actually. Usually it is a systematic social ousting, right? Like after about a year, people just start to make it very clear to me that I don't belong and that's a pretty normal experience. Right. So I thought I would break that cycle with my most recent job and just disclose my autism after I got hired. And I did that. So now the year was up and the exact same thing happened only it happened from, I guess, a more, uh, bureaucratic perspective as opposed to a social outing. Sure. Uh, so what I was told was that he was restructuring his business and, um, that basically left my job not being needed. So he just didn't have a need for me at that point,
Speaker 2 00:03:29 Of course, being a researcher for a private investigation firm, uh, led you to see otherwise, I guess, huh? Oh yeah.
Speaker 1 00:03:36 Yeah. It was. Um, and I didn't, I wasn't snooping, I didn't really care. I felt fine with the way it ended. Um, but when I got back on the job boards, I had noticed that there was recent activity on the job that he had just let me go from. So it was very clear that he had hired somebody to replace me for whatever reason, and then made up some ridiculous story about how he doesn't need my job anymore to let me go. I guarantee you, that had to do with, um, uh, trying to avoid a discrimination suit, I assume
Speaker 2 00:04:10 Could be, you know, to be fair, I would be afraid to fire you, but I live with you.
Speaker 1 00:04:16 So I, you can't find it.
Speaker 2 00:04:19 Come on, you're fired. You can get out. Thor could take me. I mean, if I run away, she tied it tire out before, and then I can take her, but endurance that's for sure. But if she hit me, I'd be out.
Speaker 1 00:04:34 I don't hit people hitting me. She doesn't hit me. It's not true. I don't hit people.
Speaker 2 00:04:41 Well, I mean, you hit things, right. I don't think so. I mean, when you're in, you know,
Speaker 1 00:04:49 I mean the bag and kickboxing, but not like actual like things, it's not like a go round smashing walls.
Speaker 2 00:04:55 Yes. But she's, she's not like she doesn't have an anger, please help. I'm just kidding. She doesn't have an anger problem and it goes around hitting walls or some crap like that. That is not the case. Um, anyway, so I, I figured that's a good for people to know that they're not alone and we hear it a lot, people from going from job to job and you've talked about it and you know, it still happens even, you know, even with this podcast, even with, uh, being self-employed and doing our own thing. Um, you know,
Speaker 1 00:05:27 Yeah. I mean, I like having, uh, uh, I like having a steady income from a job. Right. Um, it helps us do a lot of things and, and we all usually need that sort of thing. Sure. Um, but you know, I th I, I like being self-employed as well. It is way more freeing. I get to decide my schedule.
Speaker 2 00:05:47 Yeah. And it's funny, I'll tell you from my perspective, it used to make me very nervous. And after such a long time of this happening again, again, um, you know, I'm, I'm used to it and I'm just like, take it in stride. Like, you know, this is what happens. This is how, you know,
Speaker 1 00:06:04 We actually plan in our budget and we just plan for the, the expectation that I will lose my job. Right. That's just how we operate my job
Speaker 2 00:06:12 Takes care of the budget and then your job, uh, we'll take care of all the other things we want to do and save for and whatever. Right, right, right, right. So, yeah. So
Speaker 1 00:06:22 When the inevitable me losing my job for 8,000 number of reasons happens, we're not hurting. We learned that, uh, right along the way. And
Speaker 2 00:06:32 So the point is you're not alone. Uh, it still happens. It happens to Thora. I somehow have magical powers or that I can keep a job. Um, but there's, uh, there's a lot of, there's a lot of masking involved. Um, you masked better than most well, it's interesting. Cause when I see another autistic person, you know, not knowing that they're autistic, you know, it's like you got that, a
Speaker 1 00:06:56 Neuro neuro scope. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:06:58 You know, it's like, I walk into a room, I saw this guy today and he kind of walked in with a normal face and we both put our masks on real quick with that smile. Like, Hey, how you doing? Good to see you. Yeah. And I like the, you know, it's funny because, uh, when we turned that off and we get past that we couldn't have a good conversation, but it's pretty clear, you know, because I know where I'm at and I have to do that constantly. Um, you know, and it's,
Speaker 1 00:07:21 For me, I get to see the little tails when you're out and
Speaker 2 00:07:24 About. And it's easy for me because I am in and out of a place. One thing, uh, uh, one of my bosses at one point said to me was, you know, if I, if you don't like this place, you're going to be gone in 10 minutes. You know, of course at that time I had like 122 accounts. Now I have, you know, 10 good ones, you know, so I'm at the much longer, but you know, people go in and out for lunches and, and uh, so I only see them little bits, it's little, that's what I can handle, you know? So it works really well. So, but I find myself putting myself in places that is comfortable for me. You know, I remember, you know, I used to start at like five and then I start at four and then 3:00 AM, then 2:00 AM. Now I started 10, 8, 10 PM.
Speaker 2 00:08:03 You know, it's kind of funny how that, uh, and you don't have to see nobody. I still see many people, but yeah, not a lot anyway. So that's that, uh, I just wanted to put that out there for people. Um, and now let's talk about employment consultant, because that is something that we do as a business. Uh, something that Thora does really, you know, I'm usually sleeping in the middle of the day when she does that. Uh, part of it, I do the, some of the backend things. Um, yeah. So why don't you tell us about the work? Sure.
Speaker 1 00:08:35 Well, I am an employment consultant and what that means is I am essentially, uh, your coach for everything surrounding getting, finding in, well, not keeping, but getting in, finding a job. I don't know nothing about keeping a job, but I know everything about finding a job. It's actually like a, uh, a fun thing for me. Uh, resume writing for example, is, you know, I'm a word person. I, I, uh, no graphic design. I have the psychology behind the way things look and how people's eyes are drawn to certain things, just all of that body of knowledge, um, that goes into the perfect resume is it is just stuff I have learned over the years. Um, so resume writing is super fun for me. Right. Um, and then the whole actual job finding process. That's super fun for me too. Um, I re it's to me, it's like gambling. It really is. It's like, you go into a casino and you place your bet on the, you know, red 28 or whatever. And you watch that wheel turn only when you're looking for a job, you have better odds, right? I mean, at the end, there's a win. There's no loss. The loss is you continue, as you are status quo, don't have a job in the end. You win by getting a job. Like that's just, yeah.
Speaker 2 00:09:58 Yeah. I find, I guess, I guess I'm thinking is you have a better odds because of the way that you go about getting someone a job, you know, you say you have like a specific place you're hiring for a, you go in and you take all that stuff and you,
Speaker 1 00:10:14 Oh yeah. Yeah. Um, I, I highly, uh, focus on cherry picking the jobs that will work the best for you. A lot of people play that, uh, getting a job, like a numbers game, right. If I just put 50 applications in a day, then eventually somebody is going to hire me. Well, not only is it exhausting, but you're not going to end up where you need to be, want to be or even feel good being. Right.
Speaker 2 00:10:43 And also, you know, I noticed, because I talked to my managers at my work and, you know, it's kind of annoying for them because, you know, if, if people don't even remember, you know, they're supposed to have an interview at two today. And they they're like, ah, yeah, I can't do that because I can't get off work. And you're thinking like, did you not want another job? You know? But if they put 50 out there, maybe they didn't really want that job. And it's like, they're getting a call from one. That's just, eh, that's just, okay. You know, maybe it doesn't pay as much. I was really hoping for these other ones. It's like,
Speaker 1 00:11:11 Well, then don't apply to that job, man. Right? Yeah. Um, I read something, someone on Twitter was like, man, I'm not going to write a cover letter for every job I apply for that. I write 50 covered letters a day. I'm like, wow, 50 applications a day. I just shotgun. I just, I, I, I hone in, I find the jobs that will be good for me. And as I work on behalf of another person, I find the jobs that will be good for them. You know, the first thing I do is get to know who they are, what they like, what they're up to, um, their skills and, um, all that fun stuff. And that, that looks a certain way as a candidate. So then it's a matter of matching that profile against the different jobs that are out there. Um, some people don't really care what they do.
Speaker 1 00:12:13 Some people are connected to a field, whether it be the, their employment or their education field, um, or some people just have a lot of background or history in a field. So they want to stick with something they know, and that's totally fine. Right. Um, but there, even within, um, a specific field, there are different types of jobs and the employers will tell you what type of job it is. You know, if they write the job description, it is very clear by the way they write it, what that job will be like and whether or not you as a candidate or me as a candidate, uh, is going to fit that.
Speaker 2 00:12:51 Um, what do you think, uh, what do you think is like the biggest learning curve that you've had to deal with with implement consulting?
Speaker 1 00:13:00 The biggest learning curve is I think finding the communication gap between me and the client. Okay. That's usually the, that's usually the only, what's the word variable. Okay. That's the only variable once I feel like I have a good communication with the client, then everything is smooth sailing from there, but I just have to kind of figure out how particularly, because I work with autistic people. Yeah. I just have to find out what their communication style is. And once I can get on that level and just kind of like, you know, refocus myself to be speaking with them individually, then I learn all the things I need to learn and we can put them in on the right path. How long does that usually take some different, everyone is different. Yeah. Sometimes it's one session, you know, one half hour session. And by the end I'm like, okay, I got a, I got a picture of how to talk with you about certain things. Yeah. Um, I had, I had one that took four sessions before. I really got the feel for how to communicate with them and how to take from them, what they wanted and how to turn it into an actual candidate profile. I got ya.
Speaker 2 00:14:18 Yeah. I was going to say it's a, it's kind of funny because at home I'm usually the one who puts myself into someone else's shoes, you know, but when you're at work, that's something you're good at, you know? And I don't, you know, outside of work, I don't see that, like, I'm usually that guy, but inside of a job, you are that person you can, you know, you're putting yourself into someone else's shoes. I mean, that's what your job is, you know? So you're really having to think through their thoughts and, and you do a fantastic job. I hear you, you know, talking to people and it's like, how, you know, I can't make those connections that you can, you're listening to someone talk and you're, you're putting things together. That's going to get them to where they want. Of course you do that for me. So I just, you know, it's, it's so natural a feeling for me. Uh, but you can put these things together and like, uh, give them an understanding of probably they didn't even know. So it's like this Eureka moment for them. And you're just like putting the puzzle pieces together. You know, you hear these words that they're talking about. You're like, oh, that means you want this. That means you want this. And they're like, oh, I guess I do want that. You know? I mean, I know for myself, it's like that. I'm like, go
Speaker 1 00:15:25 Ahead. People give away themselves with the way they choose to speak. And sometimes it's not a choice. Sometimes it's just a natural, um, just a natural process that has honed itself over the years of existence. Right. But you can tell by the words, people choose to use, um, you know, where they're coming from, what their intention is, um, what they, what they mean by almost a whole, you know, sentence can hinge on one word, oh, you chose to use, um, progressive as opposed to liberal, you know, that means something and it changes and it's usually very consistent. So it's almost formulaic when you start to, when you drill down that deep
Speaker 2 00:16:08 Well. Yeah. And you can see that's kinda your special, uh, power really. And it's funny because it's, it's not funny, but it's, it's also kind of your kryptonite because it's like, it can, it can wear on you, you know, you always see it. It's always on. Um, and you know, it's exhausting because you know, so many people, yeah. I mean, everyone uses their words when you communicate in. So in, you're always seeing that and you're like, Nope, don't really like this jerk. And I'm like, what's wrong with him? You're like, I'll tell you later. He said, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I didn't even hear it.
Speaker 1 00:16:44 I do happen to be judgmental. But, um, but I, it works in my favor. I've had to be, I've had, yeah.
Speaker 2 00:16:50 It takes care of your, you it's your, my,
Speaker 1 00:16:53 Yeah. My defense mechanisms.
Speaker 2 00:16:55 Exactly. Yeah. And that's good. I mean, and also I feel like it kind of, it sort of protects our family as well. It's an interesting to knowing that I have view on my side, I always feel comfortable. You know what I mean? It's just, I, don't got to worry, you know, you're going to see through people, you know, cause I'm, I'm like, Hey buddy, I'm your friend, you know, I'm just, I will let anybody in, you know? And I'm like, and I kind of look at you like, is this guy okay to let it in? You know, it's like, no, you're like, yeah, I like that guy. Oh, cool. Thank God. Because you know, I'm just trying to make some friends and you said, no, have 80 people, you know? And I don't really put myself out there that much too. But if I do, you know, someone else is open. And then for me, it's like many ways, and this is off topic, but only slightly we do that. Indeed. We do. I mean, it's all you,
Speaker 1 00:17:50 Hey, um, I just am highly selective. Yep. Uh, you know, I, here's the thing we are, we become the average of the five people we spend the most time with. Right. And I am, I'm selective about those people. I'm not just gonna spend my time on any Joe Schmo. I just, you know, I spend time with people who better me as a person. Yeah. I spend time with people. I strive to be like,
Speaker 2 00:18:23 It's good. Cause that's, I hang out with the most. So you must think I'm all right. You're more than all right. Uh, yeah. You and the kids? Uh, my top three. So anyhow, um,
Speaker 1 00:18:37 That's why I keep telling you stop talking to so-and-so on the phone. Jeez. You can cut that if you want. You're gonna, you're gonna edit I'm editing this week.
Speaker 2 00:18:49 Yeah. It's Tuesday and I'll be up for an hour tomorrow. Sweet sauce. Cool. Thanks. Maybe you should have done it on Saturday when I asked you the first one, I've had it on my calendar. I can't handle all these changes, man.
Speaker 1 00:19:04 Sorry.
Speaker 2 00:19:05 Oh man. This is good stuff. We don't want to cut that out anyway. Yeah. Let's um, let's talk about autism and how it, uh, because I think it's pretty obvious how that helps you at work. You know, we kind of talked about, that's kind of your super power and I mean, being able to, maybe not, why don't you tell him crunch, you tell me, you know, what hinders you at work and what helps you at work with the having autism?
Speaker 1 00:19:31 Um, you know, I think being able to align myself with a person, uh, to help them is I think that is an autistic trait of mine. I feel like I have the ability to understand somebody and then I'm going to, um, I'm going to put them in the best position they can be in to, you know, to move themselves forward. Um, so I feel like that is, I mean, I feel like that's an autistic trait. I'm not quite sure if it is or not. I
Speaker 2 00:20:08 Don't know. I'm hard to, I have a hard time, uh, separating all those things because they all seem like just life to me and I'm still, I'm learning so much, but it's interesting. I don't know those things until I read them. I'm like, oh my gosh, that, that is too. I just thought that was my normal thing. So go ahead. No,
Speaker 1 00:20:27 That's fine. Um, I think another thing that helps me is, um, is just that, that word thing, you know, like we had talked about it, just being able to hone in on words and their connotations and then, you know, when they pile on top of one another, I get a picture of, you know, who that person is. Yeah. Um, I can do it in writing, which people find very strange, but it's, I'm, I'm always accurate.
Speaker 2 00:20:52 Yeah. No, I think it definitely is. It's it's definitely like a pattern type. Yeah. Yeah. It
Speaker 1 00:20:58 Is. It's a linguistic pattern thing. Yeah. It's pattern thinking. Very impressive. It just is. No, go on. No, I just, I dunno. It's just the thing I do. Yeah. Well, I think that's great. So it was hindering the hard part. Yeah. Hindering is the hard part. I am I'm blunt, I guess. You know, I I'm, I want to think that other autistics are going to be accepting of that, but not everybody is they want to be handheld sometimes. Yeah. I don't know how to do that. Yeah. You know? Um, I remember when I was going through this process for someone in my family, um, I, he wanted his handheld. Oh yes, he did. And I was not having it because like, not only do I know him personally, but I'm also, you know, able to, to take the words and make them mean something for his candidate profile. I knew him personally. So I was like, that's not you, you can't put that on your resume. Yeah. And he's like, well, but I get along with so-and-so. I'm like, okay, if you're going to call him a Dick and then say that you're a team player, I'm sorry, but you can't put it on your restaurant anyway. That was a fun three hours.
Speaker 1 00:22:16 Um, but yeah, I, I think it hinders me because I'm blunt, I'm affective. Yeah. But you have to be okay with being told how it is.
Speaker 2 00:22:26 Yeah, absolutely. I know. Uh, if I'm in a conversation with you, I'm, you know, I mean, I know you, so it's, you know, easy, but I mean, it's almost like you want to say, you know, this is going to hurt, but it's going to feel good at the end or something, you know, like just be prepared that I'm straightforward, you know, don't take things personally. I need you to be in that space. Be ready because we're about to start. Okay. Go. Cause I said we were about to start. Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:22:53 Yeah. But again, I think it goes back to, um, you know, my autistic traits are much more male presenting. Yeah. Um, as opposed to female presenting, I don't agree with that. I don't mask as well. And I'm, you know, which is probably what leads me to constantly being, uh, let go of jobs or just, you know, not being able to function after a certain period of time because I'm a woman. People expect me to come across a certain way it's possible and I don't meet those expectations. And of course that's a problem for them. So,
Speaker 2 00:23:30 So let me ask you, um, did you have any kind of education? Did you have any kind of special training for what you do?
Speaker 1 00:23:42 Well, the answer is yes and no. Um, no education, formally, uh, training. I have trained all my life to be good at what I do. Right. Okay. Um, I okay. Where it started way, way, way back in the day. Even before we met, actually I was working at Kinko's and uh, people would come in constantly with their resumes and they would want, oh, I want 20 copies of this on, you know, uh, whatever off white linen Perry, WinCo. Yeah. Uh, for the listeners, Adam and I have both worked at Kinko's that's where we met. And if you even remember Kinko's
Speaker 2 00:24:22 Oh, the, the Kinko do of course recovering conclusions. Right.
Speaker 1 00:24:28 Um, but yeah, so people would come in with their resumes all the time and they would put it in, you know, slide it across the counter and say, Hey, I want 20 copies of this. And I'm like, no, you don't. And they're like, what do you mean I need to get a job? Well, yeah. But you're not getting a job with this resume. And they're like, what? And I'm like my, I would immediately go to all of the mistakes. Right. All of the misspellings and all of the improper grammar and all of the missed punctuations and one job, I would just, I would see it, it was an instantaneous thing. So I think part of that is a natural inclination to see and correct mistakes in writing. Um, so I don't think there's a formal education that, that can even make them a thing. That's just something I have. Okay. Um, however, I have been honing those skills for years, uh, working in printing, working in design, understanding the psychology behind why things are done a certain way, not just in the job hunting area, but also in visually in a resume, for example. Um, one of the, one of the things that I always point out that I find extremely important, but nobody else like talks about or knows about it or it's, I don't know how they don't understand, but it is bullet points on a job. Oh
Speaker 2 00:25:54 Yeah. Yeah. I hear you tell people this all the time. Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:25:57 And it's something nobody seems to know. And it's very strange to me that they don't, but it's an it's inherently real bullet points on a job need to beat either exactly five bullet points or exactly three bullet points. It is a very strange psychological phenomenon that your eye is drawn to. And visually, uh, like, uh, appeased by odd numbers and that those very specific numbers, either five or three, make people want to read those books. That's
Speaker 2 00:26:33 Interesting. And you don't think that's just because you're odd and you want to connect with other odd things. No. I'm telling you that. I believe you. I, it is really interesting. Like, you know, how do you learn something like that?
Speaker 1 00:26:48 It's just a, it's just a cross referencing of all of my special interests essentially. Right on, you know, it's, it's, um, you know, vocabulary, it is psychology. It is the job hunting process in general. Um, having been a hiring manager, seeing what, you know, what works, what
Speaker 2 00:27:08 Stands out
Speaker 1 00:27:10 And knowing, I think everybody knows this little tidbit, a resume only gets six seconds before someone determines whether or not they're going to continue reading it six seconds. And they say yes or no. So basically you have to visually appeal to a person in six seconds. Yeah. And people don't know how to do that. I don't think, I mean, that's
Speaker 2 00:27:33 Definitely not, not with words. I mean, you see it, it's, it's pretty clear. Yeah. So, yeah. That's, that's crazy. So let me ask you what you like and dislike about what you do. I know you kind of talked about this a little bit in the beginning, but I'm going to ask you again.
Speaker 1 00:27:51 Oh, I did. I talked a little bit about like the, the feel of gambling, the feeling. Yeah. Okay. So I, I'm going to paint a picture. All right. Um, because this is really how it feels to me when I am personally going through the job hunting process. Okay. So the first thing I do is, um, I, I get to look at all of the job descriptions, right. I don't particularly define myself in one field now I've worked mainly in one field, um, document management, digital imaging for most of my career, but I don't feel, I don't feel compelled to stay there. Right. Um, so I look at everything and I read the job descriptions, and this is, this is really the only time that my brain like makes up stuff visually. It's very strange, but I imagine myself doing the job. What is it like to do a job that is called fast paced?
Speaker 1 00:28:50 What is it like doing a job that calls itself team oriented? What is it like to do this job where I'll be filing papers or whatever the thing is. Right. I take all of the job description and I just put myself in that job. I talk to the person who writes the job in my head. Right. I imagine this. Sure. And it's, it's just, uh, I don't know. It's just an imagination, creativity type of exercise where I determine whether or not I'm actually going to like that job or not. Yeah. So then I apply for the job. Um, and I do this by, um, lots of factors. I adapt keywords, take keywords from the job, put them into my resume, my cover letter. And I write the cover letter designed specifically to see this is like a fishing for me. It's like, you gotta put out the right.
Speaker 1 00:29:41 Okay. So I craft a cover letter. I change a few things about my resume. Not much, it's usually just keywords to get me through the computer system. Right. Um, but the, the cover letter itself is like the bait. I have to put out the right bait for the right person. So I take what I've gleaned from the job description and determine what type of person I'm talking to. So I know what it is they want to hear. And then I write what they want to hear and how I fit into all those, you know, missing pieces that they're missing by having this job open. Right. So I just, I basically fill in those gaps. So, so you worked
Speaker 2 00:30:25 Better with the computer than with people. Is that what you're saying? Well, no, but I mean,
Speaker 1 00:30:33 Sorry. No, I mean, yes and no. Um, but yeah, it, it is like a fishing expedition. Right. You know, I gotta put out the right bait. So once I do that, then it's like, I'm waiting. It's like, did I, you know, did I catch their attention? Are they going to call, how long is it going to take, do I wait, do I try to contact them and say, Hey, make sure you got my resume, just blah, blah, blah. You know, w how is that going to look like to that type of person? So then I'm, I'm kind of strategizing at that point. Yeah. It's like, um, you know, I'm waiting, but I'm taking my time to kind of determine what my next moves are going to be. You know, some people want that direct, assertive, um, you know, Hey, just wanted to check in and make sure you got my resume. I'm available to talk to at blah, blah, blah. Yeah. Not everybody,
Speaker 2 00:31:20 Not everybody does. Yeah. Some people, they like, if you contact them, they're like, cut out. I'm so annoyed.
Speaker 1 00:31:27 I dare you waste my time. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, some of that is clear by what's written in the job description. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2 00:31:36 Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:31:38 So, um, so that's my strategizing then. Um, I get to, this is where I, Snoop, I start, I start getting Snoopy, like, I want to see, like, what is the, what does the business mission and values? What did they, what's important to them important enough for them to put it in their mission statement? What, what means something to them? Sure. Um, I look at reviews online, you know, lots of places have the ability to review your employer. I read those all day long. Nice. Who is this company? And how do they treat people? You know, then there's like, um, just, you know, um, news articles, what is the newest thing about them? Are they, you know, are they accompany that it gets in the news regularly? You know, what, what is the company like? What what's important to them, um, who were the decision-makers and of course that's all online, it's all public record, you know?
Speaker 1 00:32:31 I mean, you can find those people and exactly how to contact them if you know where you're looking. Yeah. Um, so I use that to my advantage. And then if they call me and schedule an interview, this is the interview is so formulaic that it makes me seem like a good conversationalist. Like I'm really not. I'm very awkward and weird. And I really don't always know what to say in the moment, but because I know what to expect going into an interview, I know what they want to hear. I know what questions they're going to ask. I know exactly how to answer them. Like, I mean, it's so formulaic that it feels natural to the other person. That's so interesting. And they think, oh yeah, this person is confident. And this person knows exactly what we're up to. And they, their values align with ours. And I didn't even realize it. And you know, I mean, it just, I've never been in an interview like a physical face-to-face interview interview where I have not been offered the job.
Speaker 2 00:33:34 Yeah. You know, sorry, I'm starting to wonder if you just, self-destruct on purpose because hearing your special interest of actually getting a job, I mean, you are so into it and you love it so much, you know, that's your favorite part? You know, NABI. That was
Speaker 1 00:33:47 Good. Maybe I'm just a serial, a serial, uh, job getter. That's real job. <inaudible> only one
Speaker 2 00:33:59 Job for me. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Other jobs I'm already married.
Speaker 1 00:34:05 You see the ring Pauly Jabari. It's a rubbery. Oh Lord. It's good though.
Speaker 2 00:34:20 I, I it's, it's interesting to hear, hear it, you know, I know you of course. And so it's, it's different, but when you get into it, you know, you're excited and it's like, wow, okay. Yeah. Yeah. So that's good
Speaker 1 00:34:29 Stuff. It's like gambling only. I can only win.
Speaker 2 00:34:33 I liked that kind of gambling. That's my kind of gambling. So let's talk here real quick. Uh, let's talk about your future aspirations, right? Um, in this case, you know, I mean, where do you want to see your business going? I,
Speaker 1 00:34:52 I just want opportunities for autistic people. I want us to have jobs if we want them. And I want to break down the barriers that keep that from happening, right? Yeah. I mean, what are, what is our employment stats? It's something like 84% of us are unemployed or underemployed. Yeah. 84%. That's ridiculous. It's ridiculous. And most of us want to work. So, you know, what's the problem. Well, we know what the problem is, but you know, we're, I am,
Speaker 2 00:35:30 You can certainly bring that number down. If everyone came knocking to you, I guarantee, you know, it's like this percentage would be down. We'd get them through the part that's confusing, difficult. Uh, the, you know, people not understanding. I mean, I had the same problem. I hate interviews, you know, and you helped me. Uh, there was at least one really coached me through like the entire thing, because I, the that's why I keep a job because I hate interviewing. I don't want to go to a new job. I hate it so much. Um, it felt exactly like, you know, tests in school and I couldn't do them, you know, just I'd freeze up, but I'm always one of the best employees, you know, I always end up, once I get in there, I learned what I need to learn. And I master something, you know, move to the top every single time, every time, but the interview forget it. So, but yeah, I, I guarantee people would, uh, you'd bring that step down, just alone doing what you do.
Speaker 1 00:36:25 I hope so. That's my, that's my place, the goal.
Speaker 2 00:36:28 All right, cool. So if you see the, this business grow, um, and to the point where you're hiring other people, right? Sure. Um, how, how would you approach the interviews?
Speaker 1 00:36:42 Um, you mean like me as the hiring manager interviewing somebody from, for my business, right? Yeah. Okay. Okay. Um, I think the first thing that I would do is now, I don't know the legal ramifications of this, but I would intend to hire only autistic people. Gotcha. I don't think it's, I think there are way too many places in life where neuro-typical people have the power over the autistic people in a setting. Um, I don't want to do that in my business. Right. I don't want, um, because essentially if these people are, are going to be working with our customers in any way, I don't want that power imbalance. You know, we're a neuro-typical person has an autistic persons, um, fate in their hands, so to speak. I don't, I don't want that power imbalance in my business at all,
Speaker 2 00:37:41 But it takes a personality too. I mean, right. I mean, it's not every autistic person understands that autistic person, you know, kind of thing,
Speaker 1 00:37:48 But no, no, no, no. I mean, I would definitely look for specific skills, very specific skills. Um, but I think the first thing that I would do that would make my interview different than most people's interview. Yeah. I would send people the interview questions ahead of time. Yeah. I don't know. I mean, everybody that I have ever worked with is terrified by the interview. Yeah. And not so much because it's a terrifying thing, but it kind of inherently is sure. But it's, it, it is a whole situation of unknown. The entire thing is an unknown. Right. You're going to walk into a position in which you have the absolute least amount of power. Yeah. And then you're not going to know what they have to ask you and you have somehow, uh, shine. That is, it's
Speaker 2 00:38:39 A lot to ask. It takes two energy drinks.
Speaker 1 00:38:44 Yeah. It's hard for most people, particularly autistic people. Um, I would, I would absolutely give the interview questions to everybody ahead of time. This is what I'm going to ask you. Feel free to write your answers down and read them to me in our interview. Right. Feel free to email them to me ahead of time. I don't care. I mean, your answer is going to be your answer, whether you're sitting in front of me or whether you've got 10 minutes to answer it,
Speaker 2 00:39:11 Not to mention it shows if you do that, you know, if someone's going to take the time to be, you know, think it out, you know, have a well thought out answer or not, you know what I mean? It's like, you know, if you take the time or not, I mean that says something, right? Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely.
Speaker 1 00:39:25 I mean the answer, I don't want to say the answer is going to be the same, because if you're put on the spot, your answer is not likely going to be very good and sound more like, um, but yeah, I, I mean, I would want somebody's best foot forward and that would be giving them the opportunity to, to answer the question free of anxiety. Yeah, absolutely. That's the first thing
Speaker 2 00:39:56 It's super helpful. And then also, how would you approach managing others as an autistic employer?
Speaker 1 00:40:06 I would, you know, the thing, you know, in the positions where I have been, uh, a manager, the thing that has always worked the best and particularly I'm going to, um, uh, I'm going to say this applies quite a bit more consistently with autistic people is train the crap out of people and then let them do their job. Yeah. I hear that. I mean, I train, train, train, train, train. I will train every little detail of everything that you need to know. And then I will let you do it. I'm not going to stand over there and make and go, oh, this don't forget this. Don't forget how horrible of work experiences that I don't. That's no, that's not something I do. I will train you, but you ask the questions to figure it out. Once, you know, are some can be trained in two days, a person can take two weeks. A person might take two months. I don't care. I will train a person to the point that they feel confident to do the work on their own and then let them do the work on
Speaker 2 00:41:13 Their own. I like that. I like that a lot.
Speaker 1 00:41:16 Yeah. And then my job at that point is just to support them in doing the work. That's it support them. That's what I would do. I would not, my job is not to give orders.
Speaker 2 00:41:27 Yeah. Well, all right. So, uh, so having, having those answers kind of funny, because I didn't tell you what I was going to do here at the end. So I'm a terrible employer or interviewer let's wrap up with. Uh, is there anything else that you want to give to our listeners that you want to tell our listeners in general,
Speaker 1 00:41:53 In G in general? Sure. Or regarding the topic of this interview?
Speaker 2 00:42:00 I don't know. What do you want to say?
Speaker 1 00:42:03 All right. Uh, here is the best piece of advice I could give anybody on the job hunt. Okay. It is this you're going into an interview. They are there. The employer is there to interview you, but you have to go in knowing that you are there to interview them. It's gotta be a good fit both ways, right? I mean, change the balance of power. Like, you know, you have as much power, if not more than the person on the other side of that desk. Right.
Speaker 2 00:42:39 And no one wants an unhappy employee any more than you, you want to be unhappy with your employer. Right. I mean, it
Speaker 1 00:42:44 Goes both ways. Yeah. I mean, if you go in there with the idea that you are interviewing them, you're going to actually have questions, which makes you look much more self-assured and competent. Um, you're going to give them the feeling that you're choosing, not they're choosing, which will make them want you even more psychologically speaking. Um, just, just balance out that power. It's you have as much choice as they do. I have said no to people because of things they have said in their interview, I have ghosted employers because of things they've said in their emails. I just don't want to work for certain people. Yeah. And if you have that attitude going in, then you have a greater chance of success.
Speaker 2 00:43:30 Awesome. Well, I want to thank you for being with us here today. Thorough Shakespeare, me, Adam, and Thora. Um, let's wrap it up. We, uh, obviously we need more, we need more people to interview. So again, which we've already told you once, but we're going to tell you twice, darn it. Come to our website, cover resumes.com. Fill out the form.
Speaker 1 00:43:58 You can either fill out the form on the contact page
Speaker 0 00:44:01 Or the top of the podcast page. There's a just name
Speaker 1 00:44:05 And email and we will get right back to you and schedule
Speaker 0 00:44:07 Your interview, which is actually more like a chat. We don't, it's super casual. So thanks for being with us here today, everybody. Thank you. Love y'all.
